I dislike the smell of Babel in the morning
So, what was it really like to be part of the whole tower of Babel thing?
What, you've never heard of the whole Babel thing? Here are my Clif Notes:
One of the major parts of the story of God, as recounted in the Bible, is of the great flood that destroyed every person and animal on the earth, except for Noah, his family, and the animals they brought onto the ark with them. So after the flood, people start making a comeback, and their numbers are increasing, and they're getting a little full of themselves.
Being full of themselves, they decide to take on the building of a tower that would reach to God. God comes down to check it out, and realizes that the main reason they can take on this audacious task is because they're united, especially by language. God realizes that, as long as they stick together and are able to communicate, they're not going to populate the whole world, as He wanted: they'll just stick together and do whatever they want.
So, right in the middle of the construction project, God "confounds their language," and suddenly huge chunks of people can't talk to huge chunks of other people.
What was that like?
Can you imagine what it was like to be looking at someone, saying, "I love you," or "You're going to hurt yourself," or "Why are you standing on my prize petunias?" and the person to whom you're talking just not get it?
I can. 'Cause I get a little sense of it in my conversations with pastor types and young people types.
See, I've had lots of conversations lately. I've had conversations with pastor types (more than one, so don't anyone think it's just you, or someone you know) and I've had conversations with young people types (I've only had one, and it's you). By young people types, I am, of course, referring to anyone between, say, 15 and, oh, 29. For the sake of this conversation.
Seriously, I've talked to lots of both, and each group, in general terms, seems frustrated with the other. Pastor types don't get young people types. Most of their conversations about them start with "They just don't understand that..." or "I would have thought they'd known better..." They don't understand why young people types don't just accept the way things have always been done. They don't understand why young people types seemingly overstate things, and seem to always be operating from some degree of depression.
Young people types don't get pastor types. They're frustrated that what pastor types say and do doesn't have any bearing on their lives. Pastor types seem disconnected, uncaring, and unable to provide any direction outside of the omnipresent three-point sermon. Young people types are frustrated that when they don't understand the reason for something, the pastor type's explanation makes it plain that if they don't understand, it's because of their own problems.
Is this a broad brush? You bet, and feel free to elaborate/refute me in the comments. I'm pulling out the broad brush here 'cause I want to get to what's eating at me:
Pastor types and young people types will spend loads of time talking about each other to themselves. But they're not talking to each other - beyond surface level - at all. There is this huge disconnect, and it's a problem - below the surface. They handle pleasantries and the obligatory potluck dinner just fine, but deeper than that, there's a Babel vibe going on.
Now, in evangelical circles, the answer to this issue is to aim a service at young people types, create ministry just for young people types, yada, yada, yada. In independent Baptist circles, that's not usually done, outside of youth group ministry, but even there the youth group is considered part of the body of the church.
And I don't think that should be done. But pastor types and young people types are going to have to learn to communicate with each other at the heart level. Pastor types are going to have to stretch their view of the world, to assume nothing, to get inside young people types' heads and connect with them from the point at which they find themselves. Young people types are going to have to forgive, take care of bitterness that has resulted from past disconnections, and take a chance and be open about what they're really going through.
In the case of Babel, the effect was that the huge chunks of people scattered around the earth. If we don't do something, we're going to have a Babel effect: young people types will scatter from pastor types. Not from God, not from His Word, just from pastor types. In spirit, it's happening - has happened - already. For some, it's happened physically, too.
As it stands, pastor types will continue to be disappointed, and chalk it up to a world getting more wicked. Young people types will find an expression of life in Christ which allows them to walk in His way, or they won't, and they'll be another casualty.
It's time to move toward getting on the same page.
What, you've never heard of the whole Babel thing? Here are my Clif Notes:
One of the major parts of the story of God, as recounted in the Bible, is of the great flood that destroyed every person and animal on the earth, except for Noah, his family, and the animals they brought onto the ark with them. So after the flood, people start making a comeback, and their numbers are increasing, and they're getting a little full of themselves.
Being full of themselves, they decide to take on the building of a tower that would reach to God. God comes down to check it out, and realizes that the main reason they can take on this audacious task is because they're united, especially by language. God realizes that, as long as they stick together and are able to communicate, they're not going to populate the whole world, as He wanted: they'll just stick together and do whatever they want.
So, right in the middle of the construction project, God "confounds their language," and suddenly huge chunks of people can't talk to huge chunks of other people.
What was that like?
Can you imagine what it was like to be looking at someone, saying, "I love you," or "You're going to hurt yourself," or "Why are you standing on my prize petunias?" and the person to whom you're talking just not get it?
I can. 'Cause I get a little sense of it in my conversations with pastor types and young people types.
See, I've had lots of conversations lately. I've had conversations with pastor types (more than one, so don't anyone think it's just you, or someone you know) and I've had conversations with young people types (I've only had one, and it's you). By young people types, I am, of course, referring to anyone between, say, 15 and, oh, 29. For the sake of this conversation.
Seriously, I've talked to lots of both, and each group, in general terms, seems frustrated with the other. Pastor types don't get young people types. Most of their conversations about them start with "They just don't understand that..." or "I would have thought they'd known better..." They don't understand why young people types don't just accept the way things have always been done. They don't understand why young people types seemingly overstate things, and seem to always be operating from some degree of depression.
Young people types don't get pastor types. They're frustrated that what pastor types say and do doesn't have any bearing on their lives. Pastor types seem disconnected, uncaring, and unable to provide any direction outside of the omnipresent three-point sermon. Young people types are frustrated that when they don't understand the reason for something, the pastor type's explanation makes it plain that if they don't understand, it's because of their own problems.
Is this a broad brush? You bet, and feel free to elaborate/refute me in the comments. I'm pulling out the broad brush here 'cause I want to get to what's eating at me:
Pastor types and young people types will spend loads of time talking about each other to themselves. But they're not talking to each other - beyond surface level - at all. There is this huge disconnect, and it's a problem - below the surface. They handle pleasantries and the obligatory potluck dinner just fine, but deeper than that, there's a Babel vibe going on.
Now, in evangelical circles, the answer to this issue is to aim a service at young people types, create ministry just for young people types, yada, yada, yada. In independent Baptist circles, that's not usually done, outside of youth group ministry, but even there the youth group is considered part of the body of the church.
And I don't think that should be done. But pastor types and young people types are going to have to learn to communicate with each other at the heart level. Pastor types are going to have to stretch their view of the world, to assume nothing, to get inside young people types' heads and connect with them from the point at which they find themselves. Young people types are going to have to forgive, take care of bitterness that has resulted from past disconnections, and take a chance and be open about what they're really going through.
In the case of Babel, the effect was that the huge chunks of people scattered around the earth. If we don't do something, we're going to have a Babel effect: young people types will scatter from pastor types. Not from God, not from His Word, just from pastor types. In spirit, it's happening - has happened - already. For some, it's happened physically, too.
As it stands, pastor types will continue to be disappointed, and chalk it up to a world getting more wicked. Young people types will find an expression of life in Christ which allows them to walk in His way, or they won't, and they'll be another casualty.
It's time to move toward getting on the same page.
posted by pastor mike at 4:56 PM
7 Comments:
I've been fortunate enough to have had many pastors. In my life- I've had seven. Seven pastors, counting you- and I do count you. Each with their own way of handling things. Three of which (none you) managed to find that middle ground between the generations and failed miserably. Why? They pandered to the youth. Things became sugary sweet and not spit-in-your-face. There was no tough love with these three men.
Three others (again, none you) were/are old, grumpy men who's idea of identifying with the younger generation was to adhere strictly to schedualed moments with them and remind themselves to proclaim before a church body how blessed they are to have such a future set of believers to carry on the precious seed.
The problem with the first three is that they ran things the way so many youth ministries are run these days. They focus on giving the kids their way and having fun over growing in Christ. It pulls them in, sure- but what good is having your hands on them if you don't do anything. While kids do react to this, they quite obviously also react to the alternatives (preaching, teaching, boil 'em, mash 'em, stick 'em in a stew!). The problem with the other three is that they are not genuine. They are not sinsear and the kids pick up on those sorts of things REAL quick.
Above me in the great comment totem pole, Dave suggests "making continuous minor changes usually prevents the need for drastic measures." Duh. "For effective dialogue, both parties must eliminate emotion and rhetoric."
No. Bad, Dave. Bad!
Neither party should eliminate emotion. Emotion and passion go hand in hand and I think one of the things the younger generation has over the older is passion. Fire. Maybe I'm jaded, but the older generation has become comfortable and complacent with where their walk is at- which would be that bit about change now, wouldn't it?
I've already suggested that younger folks are perceptive. They get that this is going on. They can see that they are the future of the church and they can see that some things are not working out right. I truly believe that the younger generation is willing to make the effort to change things.
"... the younger generation doesn't often have the Scriptural knowledge necessary to have an effective dialogue." Mike-sama: You and I both know just how much Scriptural knowledge Brian and Chris have- which they tend to use against us more oft than not... but they have it. There may be some question of how or when they are applying it to their heart and life, but they know more than people think and I'm willing to bet that extends further than just those two.
In my opinion, the older generation dislikes change because of their complacency. They've adjusted to the way things work and they're so stubborn that they think that the same application will work with each new generation as it approaches them. It is not cutting the mustard, however. I reference someone who's breaklines could be cut. He had adjusted to a world outside of this one. He had grown complacent with his setting and for him it was not a matter of the world changed but he changed worlds- he still refused to adapt. He clung on to the old world he knew and was comfortable with.
Will we do the same? If we don't learn to begin to adapt slowly.
What do I think will work? Nothing, but I'm a jaded, broken shell of a man. Seriously, given that I've voiced that I feel between these two groups (I'm like the guy speaking Swaahili in Canada- it's not English. It's not French. Nobody knows what it is...) you would think I would have more to say on this. Do I feel like I communicate with the pastor-types in my church? No, and that's a huge problem for me at the moment. If I could even handle things at the level of that obligatory potluck dinner- I wouldn't be hanging out in the foyer, now would I? Experience has taught me that when I have a problem and taken it to the pastory-types I get told in the politest of ways, "I don't care" or I end up realizing he doesn't understand and there is no point in taking this further. It's because of that that I don't feel I can say anything. If I had anything I should have applied it by now.
What is it going to take to fix it? In short- a miracle. Old, stoggy, pastory-type generations (in my experience) are oblivious to what is going on and are not willing to step outside of their comfort zone to suffer the slings and arrows that are driving us depressing youth types back. Meanwhile, youthy-types like myself are so disenfranchised with the whole experience of trying to explain your existance to someone who looks at you like... well... he's bored.
If a change is going to happen, it's going to be in us bridging the connection with the generation coming up behind us- because I don't see anything helping to pay this forward.
Crap. I wrote you another book, it seems... I'm sorry. I'll stop doing that now.
Not to shoot Mr. Dave in the face, but the problem isn't that teens want change, necesarilly, but that they were raised in change.
A teen doesn't have to want their dad to walk out, or worse, stay and abuse them. These changes happen in spite of a teen's desires.
Not that it would matter if a teen did want their parents to abuse or walk out on them- after all, teens have no authority ;)
As the local Presbyterian, I'm going to tiptoe into this one, simply to note something that I think is important to this discussion.
At Pentecost, when the Spirit came, the believers spoke in different languages. I see this as the beginning of the reversal of Babel. This should give us hope that Mike's concerns can be addressed. We have been given the power of the Spirit, Who can overcome our barriers and divisions. We have been united in Christ through the Spirit; in this power, we can conquer.
Of course, at the same time, it gives us the responsibility to work towards overcoming thse barriers....
Reverting to the wide brush - proper dialogue between the pastor-types and the youth-types cannot occur outside of the spiritual leadership structure that Christ has laid out in Scripture. Very few Christians, and almost no Baptists, have any conception of what the Bible teaches on this.
The youth-types/sheep have been taught to follow the "shepherd" unfalteringly, and the "shepherd", not at all understanding his postion or authority in Christ and the local body, passionately leads the herd of sheep away from water, nourishment, and shelter in pursuit of protection and isolation from the wolves with promises that if we stay away from the wolves, God will fill us to overflowing. We structure our existence based on ignorant perception of the proper relationship with pastor types and their relationship with God. Our ignorance has put us in submission, or at least feigned submission, to self proclaimed men of God who use God primarily as a tool to manipulate people. I know - wide brush. But my experiences and relationships within independent baptists make it very clear that this is the norm within those circles.
We will never have proper relationships as long as we structure our New Testament churches after Old Testament law. Study the New Testament, and show me where Christ sanctions the pastor led church. No assumptions, no manipulations. Just Bible. Just verses.
As youth types, we will struggle until we align ourselves first with Christ, and then with other brothers and sisters who have actually studied the Bible and understand what a life with Christ should look like.
It is very clear from scripture that if you are the pastor of a pastor led church, you are wrong. Not with me - with God. God said it. Take it up with Him. Follow God. His plan works. The youth types are desperate for legitimate leadership, discipleship, mentoring. Pastor types must swallow their pride (the ultimate culprit) and seek Christ. Us youth types are walking. Not away from God, but rather, our desperate pursuit of God directly correlates with our walk away from you. You could have helped. You didn't. No hard feelings. You can still change. God's grace is sufficient. Weird huh? God sanctions leadership, just not the way you are doing it. Wise men still seek Him.
I just wnat to clarify my rantings a little bit. I do not mean to take the wide brush and accuse all pastor types of being scheming, manipulating, hateful people. I know that is not the case. There are a few well intentioned, genuinely good hearted pastor types out there who are pastoring a local body of believers with love and kindness. I believe that the percentage of good pastors is pretty consistent without respect to age. A few men truly love God and desire to please Him. However, good intentions do not guarantee anything. We must use the plan for our lives and churches that Christ laid out in Scripture. We can do things our way for a while, and we have. And here we are. We will never repent until our desire and need for God exceeds our desire for ourselves.
If anyone cares, Biblical Eldership by Alexander Strauch is an excellent resource to aid in the study of Scripture in regards to the local New Testament church leadership structure sanctioned by Christ. Available at Amazon, there are two different versions available. One is a $3.99 quick study and the other a $12.74 full fledged book. Read the quick study first - it will guide you to enough scripture to really get you thinking. This is not some sort of wacked up freak stuff. It is right out of Scripture. Quite a bit of time has elapsed since I have read it, so I will not endorse every single thing said, but overall, I know Alexander Strauch is dead on. Please read this.
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